Action Plan

[Chris]

It takes 9 months for a baby to be born but 2 years for a website about Habbo to be built? You're talking out yer arse.

I have not once said it should take 2 years. I'm simply pointing out that for various reasons, it's not as quick and easy as Tom is making it out to be.

[FlyingJesus]

I'm not saying it's quick and easy I'm saying it shouldn't take years and years and you shouldn't tell people to just sit tight while nothing is put into actual use and the entire site falls to pieces. There are lots of things that ARE quick and easy that have been dismissed because "V7 will fix that" or "we can't until we have V7", and because of that we now have maybe 2 departments that aren't completely useless

[Chris]

I'm not saying it's quick and easy I'm saying it shouldn't take years and years and you shouldn't tell people to just sit tight while nothing is put into actual use and the entire site falls to pieces. There are lots of things that ARE quick and easy that have been dismissed because "V7 will fix that" or "we can't until we have V7", and because of that we now have maybe 2 departments that aren't completely useless

Well if there is anything that a manager needs that v6 can't do then we'll happily look into it. I've got nothing to do with things that have been said in the past, so I'm not going to tell people to wait until v7 if its something that can be done with the current version.

[lawrawrrr]

We haven't used the "CANT DO THAT UNTIL V7" excuse for ages IIRC. There are some things which naturally will be made easier when v7 is released - some things are impossible on the current site and all coders are diverted onto v7 work, but it hasn't stopped us from revamping two departments to make them more relevant despite the difficulties presented back-end, which we work around. Simple fact is, we can't release V7 until it's coded.

[The Don]

Thats enough to tell me that you don't know that you're talking about.

To be fair HotelUser was working on V7 before he left in what, 2011? It's nearly 2015 it shouldn't take half a year to make a website from scratch let alone nearly 4-5 years.

[lawrawrrr]

To be fair HotelUser was working on V7 before he left in what, 2011? It's nearly 2015 it shouldn't take half a year to make a website from scratch let alone nearly 4-5 years.

When you've got consistent coders it's not that hard no, but we haven't had! I don't think Dave was ever working on it though?

[Inseriousity.]

I skimmed the thread because I was at work and I'm not allowed to use my phone so the fact I read it straight away is actually quite surprising?

After having read it fully I don't really have much else to add from what I said earlier.

AGM work is project-based
Yes maybe but it doesn't mean we're not doing it or just leaving it till later "just because". We all discuss with each other what's going on and ask each other where the projects are at so we have that encouragement - I'm absolutely not posting every idea I have on the forum for the public to see until it's ready for the public to be seen.

I have already said that the AGM team is working more like a team nowadays and that's great! The problem with waiting for things to be ready is that if it's never ready then it's never going to be seen and everyone will be wondering what the hell you've been doing.

The feedback forum is not a pack of vultures

Well that depends on your point of view really But seriously, I take what's said in Feedback very seriously and do take on board what's said and try to implement it. However, sometimes it's not very possible! But really the reason the "action plan" hasn't been released is that there isn't one to release and I really think you need to get it into your head there will not ever be one to release.

I really think you need to get it into your head that there already is one. If you're working on projects then it exists even if it's not in public. The members have already proven they are supportive when they see results, when they see people trying even if it still needs a little work or things are in its beta stages. When managers communicate what they are doing, they are generally more respected while those that try to hide away 'behind the scenes' are treated with suspicion.

If members want to criticise my workload they can go ahead as far as I'm concerned, I know how much work I do and the people who know me know that too. I don't need to post a complete list of every single minute thing I do to get that validation. I can't really think of an example where we've completely backtracked on a project screaming "aah it's too difficult" because we all take on challenges.

And I've never asked for a complete list of every single minute thing. I've asked very specifically for the names of 'big projects.' It doesn't need details released. In fact, if you'd posted the list below ages ago, that'd have been sufficient. In fact, you'd have less there because only the projects that involved the public seeing something when it was completed would need to be included (so articles/RV overhaul would count, changing management guides would be too 'minute' to be included). I wouldn't include events either which if you'd read my post fully like you said you did, you'd already know about but I'll explain it again where you mentioned it.

Lack of ideas

Well right now I have one idea which will come to fruition in January and one that I've only really started to research recently which could take another 6 months to exist. There are smaller ideas for each department as well which I relay to the managers - all these have time dedicated to them and a time frame on my personal files, but once again, I don't see any benefit to posting these to the public whatsoever.

Would only need to release the projects you had control over as again, I pointed out in my original post for the reason you brought up (the ones department managers do tend to be smaller).

Got to keep everything a secret

Got to? No. Prefer to not release stuff before? Yes. Why didn't you release all the information about the Hunger Games before, Mike? That's EXACTLY the same reason we don't publish stuff before it's ready.

I don't release information about the Hunger Games because events are short-term projects that are not usually radical or challenging. That's not to say organising a big event is easy but compared to radical ideas that have 'died' over the years due to the many practical (and understandable) obstacles involved, they're a piece of cake. As a result, I would count big events as coming under the usual duties of a manager and while still a 'project' it is really only the long-term projects introduced that would need to be included.

We have plenty of failed ideas and I don't deny those at all, and if a "secret" project (I use the quotation marks as secret is not exactly how I'd term it, it's just not public, like every organisation ever does, we don't publish things while they're still in the planning stages) does fail, I will admit it quite readily if it comes up.

Which it won't come up if no-one has a clue that they exist so yes, "secret" projects die out.

We don't need the public to "kick us up the butt" because we all work incredibly hard and tirelessly to do these things to start with, and the insinuation that we're lazy is actually fairly offensive.

I've already explained this in the thread.

Habbox needs radical action

Yup, I agree, and I think I've been fairly radical since I came into the role - I actually made sure the new Articles department worked and although it isn't perfect, it's a lot more relevant now than it used to be, the community are actually getting involved in things. RV changes are just being born now, so I'm hoping the same will happen soon, and there's some more plans in the pipeline to expand the Rares department too.

We're not careless, we are not lazy, we are accountable and will admit fault where there is some. There's a lot to do and so much potential, but we're 3 people, and if we don't have the managers to support us, we can't work miracles. I've tried really hard recently to get back in touch with staff and actually try to chat to them, nuture the good ones and carve a position for them as they are Habbox's future.

Since I became AGM, I've done the following "big projects"
• Revamp articles
• Oversee RV reforms (Dan did most of the work but I advised every time)
• Co-ordinate and design the Box every month (and write about 80% of it when noone steps forward to help, when I could just give up and actually get some sleep for that week)
• Help out with all Habbo events, making one all myself - we do this as an AGM team and it doesn't all fall to Sho
• Start the Design a Room comp

Ah yes RV reforms, you can add that to that list I made too. However you are not accountable if only 3 people know about your ideas.

As well as the normal stuff we do, such as writing department reports, chipping in while managers are away, helping out staff members, doing some normal content department work, discussing promotions and ideas for events and things and reading feedback and turning it into condensed action points for managers.

I've also tried the following, and although I wouldn't use the word 'fail', they haven't come to fruition yet:
• Pestering about getting V7 out, offering to pay for a coder out of my own pocket
• The last of the RV changes dependent on user feedback
• Within Articles, Guest Writers, although myself and @bikini; have spoken about this and are working on it soon
• Management guides (just haven't had time)

The things I will be looking at in the next few weeks and months are focusing on Content, as I've done a lot of work with RV and Articles so it's fair to try and boost that as much as possible and a community event which will come out in January, which I am not releasing more information about yet. That's the closest you'll EVER get to me publishing an action plan.

Thank you for at least having the decency to respond to my points

[Chris]

To be fair HotelUser was working on V7 before he left in what, 2011? It's nearly 2015 it shouldn't take half a year to make a website from scratch let alone nearly 4-5 years.

I'm not sure what David did to v7 other than attempting to import the rare values system. Anyway, I agree with what Laura said.

[Martin]

Haven't we had quite a few different coders/people working on it during these past few years though? How can we be sure that the current coders won't be exactly the same; i.e do a bit of work then be 'too busy' to make enough progress for it to be released within a decent time frame etc? Other departments have minimums they have to follow, so I presume the site coders are monitored too in terms of doing a certain amount of week and presenting evidence of what they've achieved? Or is it more layed back in that role?

[scottish]

Why did they say not to you paying Laura?