EU referendum could be held as early as 2016

[The Don]

It doesn't make them void as there is historical precedent already on this: the Northern Ireland Parliament (1920s to 1970s). The existence of such a 'parliament' (again, subject to the remit of the Westminster parliament) did not turn the United Kingdom into a confederal state whereby each of the two political units needed to agree for an international treaty to be signed. The decision is solely up to Westminster and Westminster alone.

Anyway, i'm done arguing legality, morally a country of 5 million people should not be forced to leave the EU (that a majority of them want to remain a part of) because the English population votes to leave.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Anyway, i'm done arguing legality, morally a country of 5 million people should not be forced to leave the EU (that a majority of them want to remain a part of) because the English population votes to leave.

Then you are arguing for a fundamental change in our constitution and statehood.

And that'll require a referendum as it would be morally wrong to change it for everybody else without asking them.

[The Don]

Then you are arguing for a fundamental change in our constitution and statehood.

And that'll require a referendum as it would be morally wrong to change it for everybody else without asking them.

Not really, just give each country their own separate EU referendums innit, or even better... just don't have one.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Not really, just give each country their own separate EU referendums innit, or even better... just don't have one.

Well that doesn't work as there's only one member of the EU here: the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

[The Don]

Well that doesn't work as there's only one member of the EU here: the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

Looks like the only solution here is to not have one.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Looks like the only solution here is to not have one.

Or just have a referendum on whether the United Kingdom, a member of the EU, should remain or withdraw.

I do agree with you however better really not to have one, instead our government ought to come clean exactly what the European project has been about, admit it lied that it was just about trade, and start proceedings immediately for withdrawal and start doing its job negotiating FTAs with the world. Sorted.

[The Don]

Or just have a referendum on whether the United Kingdom, a member of the EU, should remain or withdraw.

I do agree with you however better really not to have one, instead our government ought to come clean exactly what the European project has been about, admit it lied that it was just about trade, and start proceedings immediately for withdrawal and start doing its job negotiating FTAs with the world. Sorted.

So if there's a no vote what are you gonna do? Keep on campaigning for a second one like you're criticising the Scotts for or just accept defeat?

[-:Undertaker:-]

So if there's a no vote what are you gonna do? Keep on campaigning for a second one like you're criticising the Scotts for or just accept defeat?

I don't really criticise the SNP for it, I disagree with them of course but I am saying that the idea you were putting forward (and that Nicola Sturgeon puts forward for political reasons) don't stand up to any real scrutiny that another referendum somehow must be held if Scotland were to vote different to the rest of Britain. I understand her thinking, motives and reasoning but I am saying that unless you are a Scottish nationalist then that argument doesn't fly.

In terms of membership of the European Union, I will never ever accept the erosion of British sovereignty and democracy until the government stop pretending it is about trade and until I am standing in a ballot booth with the question "Should Britain cease to be a sovereign nation and join the United States of Europe?" which is the real question in all of this. If the real question were put forward and the truth told and we voted to join, then ultimately I would have to accept it in which case I would leave the country if I could and never come back. But will I accept British sovereignty being handed away on the basis of a decades old lie? Never.

As I have said before though, I believe it more likely that we'll be forced out in the end by the political reality of the project rather than leave on our own accord.

[The Don]

I don't really criticise the SNP for it, I disagree with them of course but I am saying that the idea you were putting forward (and that Nicola Sturgeon puts forward for political reasons) don't stand up to any real scrutiny that another referendum somehow must be held if Scotland were to vote different to the rest of Britain. I understand her thinking, motives and reasoning but I am saying that unless you are a Scottish nationalist then that argument doesn't fly.

In terms of membership of the European Union, I will never ever accept the erosion of British sovereignty and democracy until the government stop pretending it is about trade and until I am standing in a ballot booth with the question "Should Britain cease to be a sovereign nation and join the United States of Europe?" which is the real question in all of this. If the real question were put forward and the truth told and we voted to join, then ultimately I would have to accept it in which case I would leave the country if I could and never come back. But will I accept British sovereignty being handed away on the basis of a decades old lie? Never.

As I have said before though, I believe it more likely that we'll be forced out in the end by the political reality of the project rather than leave on our own accord.

Why would you move to a different country though if the UK public knowingly and democratically voted to join a federal europe?

[-:Undertaker:-]

Why would you move to a different country though if the UK public knowingly and democratically voted to join a federal europe?

Because it would cease to be my country and I wouldn't want anything ever to do it with.