Jane Collins MEP ordered to pay £160,000 to Rotherham MPs

[-:Undertaker:-]

I like that you added "/politicians" in there when it was a showbiz thing just to try making a point... and still doesn't answer the question. If the police aren't taking investigations on and reports aren't being filed, what is there for an MP to find? It's been proven in a court of law that there's no reason to believe that they knew what was happening.

MPs have a duty to speak out on important issues, indeed they can and should use parliamentary immunity if they fear criminal 'hate' charges being brought against them as Nick Griffin faced for telling the truth. The Labour-controlled Council swept everything under the rug as did the South Yorkshire Police and it is one gigantic cover up to avoid upsetting a certain demographic which votes Labour in large numbers. Don't take my word for it, take the word of the former Labour MP for the area Denis MacShane.

As for Nick Griffin, he claimed that this was happening because "it's part of their plan for conquering countries" and made no comment about Rotherham at all - his rant that you linked about was in Keighley, a couple of hours north of Rotherham and not connected politically

You think this was/is confined to Rotherham? Delusional.

It doesn't matter whether Griffin believed it was a conspiracy or a plot to outbreed, or whatever motives he gives for it. The fact is he highlighted what was going on in these towns which was widespread knowledge out there and was ridiculed by the BBC and even taken to court for saying it. Why? Because it's a cover up and those in South Yorkshire Police, the Labour Council and... others... are as guilty as those who carried out the attacks for willfully covering it up in the name of political correctness.

The official Jay Report into the scandal basically stated this:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...shire-28939089

Professor Alexis Jay, who wrote the latest report, said there had been "blatant" collective failures by the council's leadership, senior managers had "underplayed" the scale of the problem and South Yorkshire Police had failed to prioritise the issue.

Failures by those charged with protecting children happened despite three reports between 2002 and 2006 which both the council and police were aware of, and "which could not have been clearer in the description of the situation in Rotherham".

Prof Jay said the first of these reports was "effectively suppressed" because senior officers did not believe the data. The other two were ignored, she said.

The inquiry team found that in the early-2000s when a group of professionals attempted to monitor a number of children believed to be at risk, "managers gave little help or support to their efforts".

The report revealed some people at a senior level in the police and children's social care thought the extent of the problem was being "exaggerated".

Prof Jay said: "The authorities involved have a great deal to answer for."

But the current Labour MPs did not know we're told when one former MP is on record as saying he knew. :Slant:

[FlyingJesus]

Why do you never answer the actual questions put to you in favour of paragraphs of things that you want to throw out? It's known as a Gish Gallop and really does you no favours. I asked you how the MPs could know about a situation that other people were covering up and you started ranting about how MPs should be louder, and the point of Griffin being in the wrong place is very valid and nothing to do with delusions - if I say "there are axe murderers in Hastings" and then one appears in Croydon and in Maidstone, it doesn't prove me right.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Why do you never answer the actual questions put to you in favour of paragraphs of things that you want to throw out? It's known as a Gish Gallop and really does you no favours. I asked you how the MPs could know about a situation that other people were covering up and you started ranting about how MPs should be louder

I just told you. I pointed how out the Labour Council and the local Police were fully aware and indeed covered up what was going on, along with one former local MP being on record as knowing it was going on. Are the current three MPs deaf, dumb and blind?

and the point of Griffin being in the wrong place is very valid and nothing to do with delusions - if I say "there are axe murderers in Hastings" and then one appears in Croydon and in Maidstone, it doesn't prove me right.

Stating that there are Islamic rape gangs operating in northern towns (true) and the authorities were covering it up (true) was a pretty specific accusation, something he was laughed at/even taken to court for saying. Dismiss it all you wish, he was right.

Here's what Denis MacShane, former MP for the area (1994-2012) had to say -

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...ild-abuse.html

Denis MacShane, the former Labour MP for Rotherham, has admitted that as a “Guardian reading liberal leftie” he shied away from the issue of the oppression of women in the Muslim community.

Mr MacShane, who resigned in 2012 over an expenses fraud for which he was later jailed, insisted no-one came to him with child abuse allegations during his 18 years in Parliament, but admitted he should have “burrowed into” the issue.

He told the BBC: "I think there was a culture of not wanting to rock the multicultural community boat if I may put it like that.”

Admitting he had been guilty of doing too little, he said he had been aware of the problem of cousin marriage and “the oppression of women within bits of the Muslim community in Britain” but: “Perhaps yes, as a true Guardian reader, and liberal leftie, I suppose I didn’t want to raise that too hard.”

He recalled having a “huge row” with another local MP and council grandees because they were complaining about a newspaper investigation into child sexual exploitation in Rotherham, which unearthed uncomfortable truths they did not want to hear.

Deaf, dumb and blind... or liars?

[FlyingJesus]

Knowing that people are slipping under the radar with marrying their cousins isn't the same thing as knowing that a paedophile ring is running rampant, and again it's very clear that the biggest part of the blame for this not coming to light lies with the police who didn't file the reports - either within their own ranks or by letting the MPs know anything about it. I'm not sure what omniscience you think people gain when they have a seat in the Commons but surely you're aware that MPs don't wiretap the front desks of police stations

[-:Undertaker:-]

Knowing that people are slipping under the radar with marrying their cousins isn't the same thing as knowing that a paedophile ring is running rampant, and again it's very clear that the biggest part of the blame for this not coming to light lies with the police who didn't file the reports - either within their own ranks or by letting the MPs know anything about it. I'm not sure what omniscience you think people gain when they have a seat in the Commons but surely you're aware that MPs don't wiretap the front desks of police stations

Oh dear.

He recalled having a “huge row” with another local MP and council grandees because they were complaining about a newspaper investigation into child sexual exploitation in Rotherham, which unearthed uncomfortable truths they did not want to hear.

I heard the stories from there well before the story broke and I live 80 or so miles away.

[dbgtz]

I've still yet to see any evidence they actually knew.

I'm not even saying they didn't but you can't just choose to ignore the law when it suits you.

[FlyingJesus]

"Oh dear" indeed, since you're still to answer the question. The bit you quoted essentially shows that the MPs didn't know what was happening since the newspaper story was breaking news to them. By that time it was far too late

[-:Undertaker:-]

"Oh dear" indeed, since you're still to answer the question. The bit you quoted essentially shows that the MPs didn't know what was happening since the newspaper story was breaking news to them.

Actually, it suggests the complete opposite.

He recalled having a “huge row” with another local MP and council grandees because they were complaining about a newspaper investigation into child sexual exploitation in Rotherham, which unearthed uncomfortable truths they did not want to hear.

The key phrases being...

"complaining about a newspaper investigation" - suggesting disagreement or offence at the investigation rather than surprise.

"which unearthed uncomfortable truths" - uncomfortable truths suggesting something is known but now brought to light.

"they did not want to hear." - suggesting, well, they did not want to hear the truth.


You seem to have an incredible talent for looking at something that plainly says X and coming up with Y.

By that time it was far too late

Wrong, Mr MacShane ceased being a Rotherham MP in 2012 and the story broke nationally in 2013.

In the early to mid 1990s, social workers came across examples of child sexual abuse, and amid concern about young people being trafficked through prostitution in Rotherham, a youth project, Risky Business, working with people between the ages of 11 and 25 was set up in 1997.[2] In 2002, a chapter of a draft Home Office report into child sexual exploitation (CSE) in Rotherham reported "high prevalence of young women being coerced and abused through prostitution". Senior officers at the council and the police objected to the report, suggesting that some facts were either exaggerated or made up and the report was never completed.

A report in 2003 by Dr Angie Heal, commissioned by South Yorkshire Police, found "significant number of girls and some boys who are being sexually exploited" in Rotherham. In 2005, a new department of children and young people’s services was created with Councillor Shaun Wright appointed cabinet member for the department. A report by Heal in 2006 described the situation as an "organised and established sexual exploitation scene".[2] In 2008, Operation Central was set up to investigate men thought to be involved in child sexual abuse.

By then it was far too late you say... eh?

Various reports of abuse - and being documented by authorities - in the area were emerging as early as the 1990s.

[FlyingJesus]

They found out after it all happened because the papers were investigating it. It's in the words. Learn to **** read you are so annoying. And yes by the late 00s it clearly was too late because it had already occurred. AGAIN in your very own quote it says that the police were denying the allegations all along, so why would MPs be clued up about it all? They get their information from other bodies, not by walking into random houses and asking if any child prostitutes are around