Labour: White boys underachievement linked to mass migration

[-:Undertaker:-]

The article is talking about how white British boys are getting low education achievement IN SCHOOL. it's not about them not getting jobs, it's about them not getting any good grades. don't see how that's Europeans fault. myb should stop trying to place blame on others.

Nobody blames the immigrants for all these problems, it's not their fault - they're just doing what is sensible and rational for them and their families who often come from very poor countries and who are looking to better themselves. No, the people to blame are the politicians and the EU for ignoring British voters and opening the borders in the first place hence why even second-generation immigrants have even had enough.

I blame the politicians 100%, the immigrants 0%.

[Kardan]

The British education system is crap, I agree - that's why I constantly argue for the return to selective education which was destroyed with the abolition of the grammar schools. So sure, the education system has huge gaping holes in it and there are many problems with it... but it's not helped and indeed, it's compacted with mass immigration - especially when it comes to post-education job prospects. It's refreshing to see that some in Labour are waking up to this and exactly what they have done.

As for your second part, spoken like a true politician. The last government threw buckets of money at schools and education yet they're still absolutely dreadful, so creating shiny new schools clearly isn't what is at fault. What's at fault is the comprehensive system itself, which being left wing I assume you support... but that's an argument for another day.



This is most important and i'd be interested to hear your response to this, I should have said this earlier but here..

You can bend it all you want, but the fact is that even if British kids were better educated or at the same level as Poles it still wouldn't matter for the fact that you don't need to have the best brains to be a plumber or somebody who picks crops in a field. When the employers look for the people to do these jobs, they will pick those who will work for the lowest wage (often under the minimum wage - which you lot support) and who are unlikely to have children as they then avoid all the maternity leave regulations, ie young single Polish men.

You can educate every Briton to the level of an Einstein yet that still won't solve the chronic problem of jobs being taken by migrant workers in the manual labor market.

Of course, it depends on what level you look at...

If more British kids are having a crap education, you'd expect them to take these more basic jobs, but as we both know immigrants working for a lower wage than minimum wage is what causes the problem here, as you've said, that is another argument and we've gone over that before.

If we look at kids going through further education from GCSEs, then I can see why immigrants might want to put their children into the education system. I mean, if less British kids are entering, there's clearly more spaces open - if there's more spaces, grades are likely to be lowered in an effort to fill spaces, meaning a greater chance of getting in.

I mean, just look at all the foreign students in British Universities - they must be somewhat decent if people come all over the world for them. And as a parent, if you had to decide between letting your child grow up in Poland and getting the money together to send them over to Britain when they're 18 for Uni, or immigrating to Britain in the first place whilst claiming benefits as they grow up and eventually getting student finance to send your child to Uni when they're 18 - I know what sounds the easiest option.

I'm probably going off at a tangent, and it's probably unlikely for many immigrants to go through that sort of thinking, but at the end of the day, if we improve the education system so more British people are able to fill these jobs, then it will reduce immigration slightly. As I said before though, the jobs that require no qualifications are a different matter, since improving the education system won't have much impact on those areas of employment.

[FlyingJesus]

Correlation does not imply causation

[-:Undertaker:-]

Correlation does not imply causation

The Shadow Education Minister certainly disagrees' smarty pants.

I'm probably going off at a tangent, and it's probably unlikely for many immigrants to go through that sort of thinking, but at the end of the day, if we improve the education system so more British people are able to fill these jobs, then it will reduce immigration slightly. As I said before though, the jobs that require no qualifications are a different matter, since improving the education system won't have much impact on those areas of employment.

Agreed.

[Chippiewill]

highlighting low attainment in schools in Lincolnshire, Norfolk, Suffolk and on the Kent coast which have seen high levels of EU migration.

What a massive crock of ****, I very rarely see immigrants in Norfolk.

[-:Undertaker:-]

What a massive crock of ****, I very rarely see immigrants in Norfolk.

That's like saying because you haven't experienced people in your area using food banks that they don't use/or need food banks in your area. I personally, and luckily, aren't affected by mass immigration due to the fact that I live in Liverpool (which is hardly affected at all) and more to the point - i'm lucky enough to live in an area of Liverpool which hasn't been taken over and ghettoised. I do know of certain areas though.

So as blessed as I am in that regard, it still doesn't mean other areas of the country aren't massively struggling.

[Kardan]

Correlation does not imply causation

This made me chuckle But it's essentially what the guy in the article has done, so there's not much proof for his statements.

[Chippiewill]

That's like saying because you haven't experienced people in your area using food banks that they don't use/or need food banks in your area.

Sorry, I don't think those are comparable situations. I think if Norfolk had high immigrant levels I would notice by virtue of more people I see being immigrants. If somehow it doesn't affect what I see then **** immigration controls, let them all in, since there's no difference apparently.

Clearly this is a case of someone MASSIVELY ************.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Sorry, I don't think those are comparable situations. I think if Norfolk had high immigrant levels I would notice by virtue of more people I see being immigrants. If somehow it doesn't affect what I see then **** immigration controls, let them all in, since there's no difference apparently.

Clearly this is a case of someone MASSIVELY ************.

That depends where you live in Norfolk.

Most of Lincolnshire will be British but if you live in Boston and Skegness it's a different story. Same as in Liverpool if you happen to live in Maghull or Aintree, venture into Toxteth or say Kensington then it'll be a different matter. Or London - Westminster vs Tower Hamlets.

[FlyingJesus]

The Shadow Education Minister certainly disagrees' smarty pants.

Then he's either a fool or purposely making use of fallacy to lie to the people since it's quite simply FACT that correlation does not imply causation, and nothing in the article shows an actual link