No release for Peter Sutcliffe

[Inseriousity.]

Then by that logic you would be against any form of punishment/form of custody as it would not bring them back from the dead.

No because there are other factors involved that means I support imprisonment but do not go to the extreme of the death penalty. The only factor that would persuade me to support said death penalty is if it brought them back, which is impossible unfortunately.

[Hecktix]

So the death penalty isnt 'immoral' as many in death penalty threads claim, which is my argument. The idea that the use of death in punishment is 'wrong' can only be backed up if you disagree with euthanasia and abortion as you believe death is wrong when induced onto somebody. The child being aborted never choose or did anything to be killed for, the murderer on the other hand made his choice when he killed another human being. The person wanting euthanasia also made their choice.

It cannot be pick and choose for the argument when it comes to morals. If somebody argues against the death penalty on morals then fine I cannot challenge ones morals - so long as their morals make sense and are consistent. Often the morals argument is picked up upon by opponents of the death penalty as a way of forcing the discussion to a close when in reality, their views are very hypocritical indeed.

You may notice, that I didn't mention abortion - I mentioned euthanasia. Abortion is something I have neutral opinion on, I am both for and against. However I am for euthanasia (as if someone wants to die and has valid reasons to die, I believe they should be able to) however against the death penalty because I feel that nobody should be killed if they don't want to be killed - that's how it should be.

This is why I don't agree with the death penalty tbh. Ian Huntley has tried to kill himself how many times now? If he succeeds, his punishment is up. He shouldn't have the easy way out.

Yes, I agree it's the easy way out but to be fair he is better off dead - if I worked at Broadmoor and I caught him trying to top himself I'd walk on by, if he wants to die - let him, it'd save us a lot of money however we cannot be killing convicts if they don't want to die. I'd say the fact that the moment they kill and get convicted their life as they know it is over is enough punishment and whether they live through this punishment or die they still get the punishment of their life as they know it being over and I'd imagine the sense of freedom is the biggest factor affecting those in prison, they don't get the sense of freedom when dead either though - but I must highlight I'm not for the death penalty, I just think euthanasia could be used in prisons for those wishing to end their lives rather than spend the rest of their life in prison, purely because it saves us money.

Ian Huntley is sitting (alive) in a nice warm prison cell, with access to a variety of activies in prison (such as gyms etc most of which normal people cannot even afford at times). He also has an Xbox in his prison cell along with reported access to Facebook and the internet. Holly and Jessica are reduced to skeletons in the ground now, and i'm sure they'd swap anyday with the comfortable lifestyle Huntley has now compared to their tragic little lives that were cut short by that monster.

Do not pretend he is suffering because it is a total insult to them two innocent little girls.

Let's be honest here, if he wasn't suffering he wouldn't have tried on multiple occasions to kill himself, the man has no freedom - like all other prisoners, he has to abide by the prisons routine, by no means is he not suffering.

[Trinity]

You may notice, that I didn't mention abortion - I mentioned euthanasia. Abortion is something I have neutral opinion on, I am both for and against. However I am for euthanasia (as if someone wants to die and has valid reasons to die, I believe they should be able to) however against the death penalty because I feel that nobody should be killed if they don't want to be killed - that's how it should be.

The innocent murder victims didn't want to be killed, but they were. Why should criminals get to choose?
If they don't want to die, they shouldn't kill people.

[Hecktix]

The innocent murder victims didn't want to be killed, but they were. Why should criminals get to choose?
If they don't want to die, they shouldn't kill people.

Well that's about lowering to their levels, no the innocent murder victims don't want to be killed and this is precisely why murder is a crime and is immoral - capital punishment is the exact same crime.

[Trinity]

Well that's about lowering to their levels, no the innocent murder victims don't want to be killed and this is precisely why murder is a crime and is immoral - capital punishment is the exact same crime.

It's not the same at all. They murdered innocent people, we'd be getting rid of scum, saving the country a bit of money, making room in prisons and *hopefully* discouraging other people from committing serious crimes.

[Hecktix]

It's not the same at all. They murdered innocent people, we'd be getting rid of scum, saving the country a bit of money, making room in prisons and *hopefully* discouraging other people from committing serious crimes.

If the death penalty had worked like that in the first place then it wouldn't have been abolished for being unfair and totally immoral. Unless the person wants to die nobody has the right to take a life, no matter what someone has done.

In God's eye no matter what a man has done his sins can always be repented. Whilst I am not religious this concept of an everlasting open arm of forgiveness is a good opposition for the death penalty - if s person is murdered immediately upon conviction they have no time to consider what they've done and in a lot of prison suicide cases it's often recorded that the prisoner makes comments about regretting their actions or accepting they did wrong or are a bad person, although it takes time for criminals to realise this - they need to understand what they have done.

As for using the death penalty as a scare tactic it wouldn't work, scare tactics never work it's psychologically proven.
Besides those who murder are not sane individuals, they are clinically insane - they won't care for the consequence.

[Trinity]

If the death penalty had worked like that in the first place then it wouldn't have been abolished for being unfair and totally immoral. Unless the person wants to die nobody has the right to take a life, no matter what someone has done.

I think there were other reasons for it being abolished, like the risk of killing someone and then finding new evidence to prove them innocent or something.
I also think that it was abolished partly because the legal system is becoming too soft.
The way I see it, the murderer does want to die. They understand that they could be put to death for their actions, and go ahead with it anyway.

In God's eye no matter what a man has done his sins can always be repented. Whilst I am not religious this concept of an everlasting open arm of forgiveness is a good opposition for the death penalty - if s person is murdered immediately upon conviction they have no time to consider what they've done and in a lot of prison suicide cases it's often recorded that the prisoner makes comments about regretting their actions or accepting they did wrong or are a bad person, although it takes time for criminals to realise this - they need to understand what they have done.

I shall ignore the god comment, I have very strong views on religion and don't want to take this thread off topic.
I'm not suggesting murdering them immediately on conviction.
It doesn't matter if the criminal accepts what they did was wrong or not, the simple fact is they've proven they have the capability to kill, and could quite easily do it again. That bit doesn't have much to do with my death penalty argument, I'm only suggesting the death penalty for when it's 100% certain that the person would/wants to commit more serious crimes.

As for using the death penalty as a scare tactic it wouldn't work, scare tactics never work it's psychologically proven.
Besides those who murder are not sane individuals, they are clinically insane - they won't care for the consequence.

I admit that scare tactics aren't very effective, that's why I said hopefully, not definitely, but they do work sometimes. If it discourages just 1 person, then that's enough to make it all worthwhile in my opinion.
Your last comment is just wrong. Not all murderers are clinically insane.
I'm also not just suggesting the death penalty for murderers. Any serious crime where the offender is 100% certain to continue having a serious negative effect on other people and has no chance of changing.

[Samantha.]

I'm glad he hasn't been released because he would only go out and kill again and that's just wrong and there is no need for it. If anyone should be killed, it should be him. 30 years wasn't enough time in prison anyway!