Videogames as an art form

[Fez]

Every six months or so, someone will suggest that videogames need to be more thoughtful and provocative. Then there's two responses from two different groups of people. One group will nod in agreement while sneering down their noses at the other group who simply state "games just need to be fun."

This topic has been done to absolute death but I don't think there's ever actually been a proper consensus. So why not start now?

Art is a loose, subjective thing and can mean many different things to many thousands of people. Some say it's taking the human condition, others says it's exploiting just human traits and I personally think it's something that changes your perception.

So, what's a videogame?

For every fifteen little morally shallow games (a la Infamous), there will be one hundred gorefests or multiplayer things that 12 year olds will gobble up (Gears of War, not calling you all 12 year olds) and there will be only one massively unique title. As it currently stands, I think that there's only a few titles which have shifted the balance of FUN versus EXPRESSION. It is an entertainment industry, no doubt about that, and games should never be without fun. I hate artgames which all try to fill themselves with pretentious metaphors and overlays of "But we're indie devs!"

If you think MW2 is the greatest game of all time, I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm just going to say that you need to play more games. There's so much more fun on offer than just shooting your mates. I discovered so much about myself and videogames have taught me more than anything else. Sounds massively sad but it's what I believe. If they have this power on a little saddo like me then they surely have potential on everyone.

Would like to get your thoughts.

[Black_Apalachi]

Erm... are you basically talking about Little Big Planet?

I would be one of those people who need to play more (modern) games but I would never say MW2 was the greatest game of all time. For me once I get used to [and therefore good at] a game I much prefer to stick with it than start from scratch on a different one. So for instance, I'm used to COD and I've played FIFA all my life, therefore I'll probably never bother trying PES or any equivalent to COD. Purely because even though I may complain about some aspects of those games, I'm still happy with their layout and everything is familiar to me.

I've probably just gone off on one but to fair I'm not perfectly clear on the original topic - surely to determine whether a game should be considered art or not you must look at the intentions of the developers? Games like COD exist purely to make as much money as possible. They're marketed to hell, released with tons of merchandise and are given a relatively high price tag. I imagine when LBP was being made, the developers were thinking about how to get the player to interact as much as possible and allow them to be as creative as they want. I would guess that's about as close to art as a game can be.

[Niall!]

If you've never played Ico or Shadow of the colossus then you don't know **** about video games as art.

[dbgtz]

If you've never played Ico or Shadow of the colossus then you don't know **** about video games as art.

art comes in many forms.

for example:
littlebigplanet is diy art
heavy rain has the art of its story
cod4+ has its online art

[Simmzay]

Are you saying netcode is art?

[Fez]

heavy rain has the art of its story

Did you not read the massive plotholes article I sent you?

If you've never played Ico or Shadow of the colossus then you don't know **** about video games as art.

Played both, Shadow is the greatest game ever made. I would add Okami, Bioshock and probably every Valve game ever to the list too.

Whole damn lot more.

[dbgtz]

Yes I did but I still think the story as a whole is great.