Britain on the Brink / Scottish Independence Referendum

[jam666]

The EU is a very touchy subject that has being argued to death. However new light needs to be shed on our membership to the EU and the radical effect that recent events could have on our nation.

With the recent referendum on the voting system, new calls have went out for a referendum on our memership to the EU. With an ever growing eurosceptic movement across the UK can we force a referendum and end this fiasco once and for all?

Here is a video that explains why Britian is on the brink and what the ramifications will be when we see its depise and it isnt pretty. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jZ6MpA-LtE

HOWEVER recent events put a potential disasterous spin on the quest to leave the european union and thats because of the SNP's win of a majority in the Scottish Assembly (Not a Parliament). With their view of independence and determination to have a referendum on the issue will this cause problems for the UK and in particular England?.

Opinion polls indicate that the people of Scotland do NOT want independence but if the referendum did produce a "get out of the constitution" vote what would the ramifications be?.

If Scotland did leave the UK (I don't see how they could and survive but...) I would forsee that many issues would be a "sticking point" such as the share of the national debt, naval bases, economic migrants across the border etc but there is one big issue here and that is the enroaching EU.

With Scotlands removal from the UK, I suspect their EU membership would be questioned and as a direct result of that I feel that a move for them to adopt the euro is coming very close. What political and economic effect would this have?, as the border between England and Scotland would become something quite similar to what we see in northern ireland / republic of ireland and what are your views on this issue?

[Conservative,]

Pull out of the EU now. Sooner the better - all it does is cost us money and sovereignty. Agree trade agreements, agree migration agreements, agree treaties, but just get the **** out of the EU.

Then give the Scots independence because I don't like how they can vote on who is in parliament in England without letting us vote who's in parliament for Scotland.

[Hecktix]

Then give the Scots independence because I don't like how they can vote on who is in parliament in England without letting us vote who's in parliament for Scotland.

You're being a bit silly here Robbie They can vote in the Westminster Parliamentary Elections because Westminter has power over Scotland, the Scottish Parliament has no powers over England therefore it'd be stupid for English people to be able to vote in them.

Scottish Independence would be absolutely dire for the state of the United Kingdom, well it would be the beginning of the end for the United Kingdom and Scotland would collapse economically woo more economic disaster.

[-:Undertaker:-]

I am a Unionist and I consider myself British and not English. However, I think we are reaching the end of what was never a 'proper' nation and was with what happens with all artifical nations, it eventually falls apart with examples including Belgium, the Soviet Union, Yugoslavia and is the fate which awaits the European Union hopefully sooner rather than later.

The choice is clear and I think Enoch Powell was spot on with this, either we are governed as one nation from Westminister or we end it. The choice should be put to the Welsh, Northern Irish and Scottish people that either devolution is reversed or we break up. If the choice is made to end the United Kingdom then I will be sad, but its a choice the people should make and they shouldn't be kept a part of it should they wish to leave.

Scotland and Wales on their own in particular (I do not think the Northern Irish would leave) wouldn't have to become failed states, infact if you look at the examples of Singapore, Hong Kong and other rich small city states then it can be made a success - however as usual this requires capitalism, and it would mean Scotland and Wales would both have to end their welfare states overnight in order to do this which would fund lower taxes.

Somehow, I don't think this would happen and it would be much more likely that they would become suckers on the teet of which is the European Union, which of course is funded by a large extent by England - unless we leave, as we should.

[Red]

If that ever happened, then that will most probably mean, a united Ireland. Can't think of anything worse.

[StefanWolves]

The Scottish want Independence? Let em' ******* have it!

[Conservative,]

You're being a bit silly here Robbie They can vote in the Westminster Parliamentary Elections because Westminter has power over Scotland, the Scottish Parliament has no powers over England therefore it'd be stupid for English people to be able to vote in them.

Scottish Independence would be absolutely dire for the state of the United Kingdom, well it would be the beginning of the end for the United Kingdom and Scotland would collapse economically woo more economic disaster.

Yes but that's the problem. The Scottish have two Parliaments - which is really stupid. I agree with Dan here:

I am a Unionist and I consider myself British and not English. However, I think we are reaching the end of what was never a 'proper' nation and was with what happens with all artifical nations, it eventually falls apart with examples including Belgium, the Soviet Union, Yugoslavia and is the fate which awaits the European Union hopefully sooner rather than later.

The choice is clear and I think Enoch Powell was spot on with this, either we are governed as one nation from Westminister or we end it. The choice should be put to the Welsh, Northern Irish and Scottish people that either devolution is reversed or we break up. If the choice is made to end the United Kingdom then I will be sad, but its a choice the people should make and they shouldn't be kept a part of it should they wish to leave.

Scotland and Wales on their own in particular (I do not think the Northern Irish would leave) wouldn't have to become failed states, infact if you look at the examples of Singapore, Hong Kong and other rich small city states then it can be made a success - however as usual this requires capitalism, and it would mean Scotland and Wales would both have to end their welfare states overnight in order to do this which would fund lower taxes.

Somehow, I don't think this would happen and it would be much more likely that they would become suckers on the teet of which is the European Union, which of course is funded by a large extent by England - unless we leave, as we should.

I agree with this principle. Either we are all governed by 1 parliament, 1 set of laws etc. OR we all have our own independent parliaments, different laws or whatever. But there can't be a mix of both. It is both unfair to England - letting others have a say in their laws, but not allowing them have a say in other's laws - as well as costly and pointless. If they want independence, give it to them. Then don't give them help when they crash and burn - after all, it's what they want.

[Jordy]

I'm afraid the EU is mostly irrelevant from this debate, it has little to do with Scottish independence. No doubt an independent Scotland would immediately be part of the EU seeing as it would be recognised by all countries and would meet the criteria. The SNP is supportive of the EU too, perhaps in the future they'd move to the Euro but looking at how atrocious it has been in recent years, I can't see them rushing to join.

I whole heartedly agree with Undertaker and Right-Winger on the issue. We either have the union as it was before 1997 (No devolved parliaments!), which lets face it is impossible to reverse as most people seem to like this or we move to independence, beginning with Scotland. They seem to want it and seem to think they'll be fine being governed from Edinburgh completely reliant on North sea oil & gas. I suspect they'd be in a complete mess and want a bailout within years, it strikes me that there's very little oil & gas left. This article in The Times explains how they'd be portioned off some of the debt and be left with an enormous deficit; http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle7044017.ece

I'd be interested in what this would mean for things like the armed forces though, would they be split up? What would England, Wales and NI collectively be called? Would the Welsh then push for independence?

[Sarah]

I'm afraid the EU is mostly irrelevant from this debate, it has little to do with Scottish independence. No doubt an independent Scotland would immediately be part of the EU seeing as it would be recognised by all countries and would meet the criteria. The SNP is supportive of the EU too, perhaps in the future they'd move to the Euro but looking at how atrocious it has been in recent years, I can't see them rushing to join.

I whole heartedly agree with Undertaker and Right-Winger on the issue. We either have the union as it was before 1997 (No devolved parliaments!), which lets face it is impossible to reverse as most people seem to like this or we move to independence, beginning with Scotland. They seem to want it and seem to think they'll be fine being governed from Edinburgh completely reliant on North sea oil & gas. I suspect they'd be in a complete mess and want a bailout within years, it strikes me that there's very little oil & gas left. This article in The Times explains how they'd be portioned off some of the debt and be left with an enormous deficit; http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle7044017.ece

I'd be interested in what this would mean for things like the armed forces though, would they be split up? What would England, Wales and NI collectively be called? Would the Welsh then push for independence?

The fact the nationalist party is failing in wales, and lost seats is a clear rejection of independence. I don't think Ive ever met anyone who wants independence, maybe more so in the north.

[Jordy]

The fact the nationalist party is failing in wales, and lost seats is a clear rejection of independence. I don't think Ive ever met anyone who wants independence, maybe more so in the north.

Yeah I noticed Plaid Cymru lost some seats, they're no where near as powerful as the SNP's power in Scotland. I imagine though if Scotland did well under independence, the Welsh would soon begin to warm the idea. However if it wasn't working well for Scotland, no doubt Wales would still want to be part of the UK (or whatever England, Wales and NI make up).