rare values reform

[Lewis]

Like you, I'm also no trading expert but the last few polls indicated that there was a demand for the system still there, a silent majority so to speak and that's why the RV department has survived. It is perhaps one flaw of the feedback forum that it's filled with people who'll never enter comps regardless of what happens to them but suggest how to improve them, hardly play Habbo but suggest how to improve hxhd or events etc etc. Obviously I don't think that means that they should be totally ignored but managers do need to bear it in mind when they change stuff. I'll never use rare values cos I don't trade, hate it so much! I dunno how the RV staff do it

Last time I was in rare values (years ago though) the manager just told us to copy values off the MP lol, which I do find a bit pointless for most items

[-:Undertaker:-]

Yeah, like I said, I'm not great at furni but even I know army plasto, straypixels, that rug etc are all really tough to get hold of and really should be added back @-:Undertaker:-;

Yes, they'll be added back for sure including the likes of the Chesterfield Sofas etc.

I've sent a PM back about categories so I can add them back asap as soon as we know how we're going forwards.

To help along I've just found a few more that should be added as soon as possible.

Bolt Of Zeus
(The) Golden Tablet
ads_campguitar
Currency items that aren't standard (Rubies, Sapphires, Crowns etc.)
Mystic Duck/Exec ICM perhaps?
Robot Dinosaur
All Crackable Eggs
etc.

Just trying to help . There are probably a lot more.

Indeed, shall bring back as soon as possible once categorisations are sorted.

No doubt I will miss some though, so within next few days i'll open a public thread asking what items should be added back. In reply to others comments about some seasonal ranges, perhaps some could be made permanent... that's certainly an option.

[HE-Joshua]

Last time I was in rare values (years ago though) the manager just told us to copy values off the MP lol, which I do find a bit pointless for most items

Definitely but for historical value and trends is essential for traders and people who just want to buy furni at the right price.

[-:Undertaker:-]

Just an update guys -

Myself and General Management are just checking whether what we have in mind for the categories is workable and if so then it'll start within days: I know some of you are asking for certain items (teleporters for example) to return and as soon as I know the future structure of the categories - which will, if plan are approved, be a new useful feature - then I will re-add those items you've been asking for.

Any seasonal/misc items of high value/interest that you'd like re-adding within the next week? Post them below xx

[Samantha]

Sorry, it's been around 2 weeks since the 'reform' and I understand you were removing items, but it would have just been more simple to begin by renaming categories before messing with anything on view. I've had countless people massing on Habbo about how Habbox Rare Values are now ruined and they may as well set up their own site to at least value a better range of items. I understand it's a massive job to take on, and most of your staff have resigned, but the reason some of them have resigned is because of this reform and the way you've gone about it.

The teleports category shouldn't have even been touched because there isn't a solid value on client for them - they can't be put in the Market Place and Habbox had that unique feature to it, now it doesn't. It may sound over dramatic, but it seems Dan that as long as it is 'rare' to you then it stays. Why not research what rares are worth keeping and what aren't? As at the moment, you are missing so many key items and because of that people are looking elsewhere or trying to get valid values for items. The arcane super rares didn't need to be touched, they could have easily gone in a category whereby the value could have been easily updated - there have been a few sales of poster_0_name but is there any point in us reporting them anymore when they're not even on the site?

I understand that it's a reform, but I don't think you've gone the right way about it - why start messing with the front end when the back hasn't been complete? I knew the reform was coming, but I at least thought more time and effort would have been put in as frankly it wouldn't have needed a feedback thread, well not one as negative as this.

There are items on the site not released, why are they on when they serve no purpose currently? A Wiki or site page could be made to list them all, or something similar as they're just taking priority over items needing to be there
there.

I don't agree with your more recent post either - high value seasonal/misc? Guess my opinion, and others doesn't matter as there are items rarely traded yet they're not high value. I don't see why we should just suggest the high value ones because more players will go to the Market Place for the price. You do need the items like Stately Roofs, Royal Tea Lady, Union Jack Sofas stuff like that. Not only the misc rares, but supers that are getting harder to come by, Crackable Eggs, Pinatas, the Pinata Guitars, the Army Plasto.

It would have made sense to get asking what people would like before now. I understand you may be busy, but it seems a lot isn't getting done currently. There aren't many rare values staff anymore, they all have reasons for resigning though, why should they be expected to do the work if some aren't pulling their weight or setting an example.

Sorry, it seems like an unfair rant, but you've been in the position a long time now and it's frankly not getting better. It's early days for the reform understandably. However, I just hope that when this is finally sorted correctly that you still have users for it.

This isn't anything against you Dan, it's more I don't think people agree how the reform has been done, me included.

I do have a question, we're rare values staff told about this before it went live?

[-:Undertaker:-]

Sorry, it's been around 2 weeks since the 'reform' and I understand you were removing items, but it would have just been more simple to begin by renaming categories before messing with anything on view. I've had countless people massing on Habbo about how Habbox Rare Values are now ruined and they may as well set up their own site to at least value a better range of items. I understand it's a massive job to take on, and most of your staff have resigned, but the reason some of them have resigned is because of this reform and the way you've gone about it.

It has been two weeks since reforms had been announced yes..... and what? If you would like the task to be done within 24 hours then I am afraid I simply cannot fit that in: namely because how we're going forwards is being finalised (and General Management have other issues to look at, as well as their own lives to run) along with the fact I have just spent the last two or three weeks seeing family, hosting friends from other countries in my house and starting my third year in university. In any case, the scale of the task isn't possible to carry out within a day.

The teleports category shouldn't have even been touched because there isn't a solid value on client for them - they can't be put in the Market Place and Habbox had that unique feature to it, now it doesn't. It may sound over dramatic, but it seems Dan that as long as it is 'rare' to you then it stays.

And items which have been removed but users feel should return, will return when the structure of categories are decided (which is very soon, a PM away if all goes well). Will the world end in the meantime? No. Have I said anywhere here that what had been removed for now or how the categories are ordered now is how it is going to be from now on? No.

I have purposely been flexible as with my post above asking you all for what items you would like to see return over the next few days. Instead of asking me to write out yet more fruitless paragraphs and plans rather than getting on with the job at hand, would it not be better to actually suggest items you think should be returned as I have asked?

Why not research what rares are worth keeping and what aren't? As at the moment, you are missing so many key items and because of that people are looking elsewhere or trying to get valid values for items. The arcane super rares didn't need to be touched, they could have easily gone in a category whereby the value could have been easily updated - there have been a few sales of poster_0_name but is there any point in us reporting them anymore when they're not even on the site?

If I did as you suggested and 'researched' every rare item - thousands of them - then we would never actually get to reforming the department and it'd just be all talk just as it has been for years and years. Even if I were able to research every single item and then begin reforms and dropping some items, I would still have criticism coming my way that I had missed out item X, Y or Z.

Less talk on Habbox, more action.

I understand that it's a reform, but I don't think you've gone the right way about it - why start messing with the front end when the back hasn't been complete? I knew the reform was coming, but I at least thought more time and effort would have been put in as frankly it wouldn't have needed a feedback thread, well not one as negative as this.

In other words, why don't we keep talking about reform instead of actually carrying it out?

Most big 'plans' on Habbox in my experience have tended to be just lines and paragraphs full of talk, but in the end they very rarely end up being carried out. Plans are doomed more or less to fail, especially grand plans *cough V7*.

Reforms are being carried out. We can either help with that process by suggesting missing items, like i've suggested or we can keep adding to the workload by talking about including the Wiki (itself a mammoth task which would entail hundreds of new pages being created with paragraphs of text), endless 'research' on thousands of items and arguing the toss in this thread.

Which is better? I would prefer to just get on with it.

There are items on the site not released, why are they on when they serve no purpose currently? A Wiki or site page could be made to list them all, or something similar as they're just taking priority over items needing to be there
there.

And that is something that can be done in the future in regards to the Wiki. Both Laura and Chippiewill have ideas in mind for this, but this really isn't something that can be done with a snap of the fingers let alone by both departments: you only this week asked me to return to the Content Department which suggests you're struggling with Wiki content as it is - do you really think it wise to drop a huge mammoth task of work on both yourself and myself, one that could take months?

I don't agree with your more recent post either - high value seasonal/misc? Guess my opinion, and others doesn't matter as there are items rarely traded yet they're not high value. I don't see why we should just suggest the high value ones because more players will go to the Market Place for the price. You do need the items like Stately Roofs, Royal Tea Lady, Union Jack Sofas stuff like that. Not only the misc rares, but supers that are getting harder to come by, Crackable Eggs, Pinatas, the Pinata Guitars, the Army Plasto.

Not solely high value.

I have said a few times that items of historical or unique interest will be re-included in the values.

http://www.habboxforum.com/showthread.php?t=814471

We will also retain items such as the Romantique Clock which although belong in Misc groupings of furniture, retain such a level of value and interest that they are worth keeping on our pages.... the same applies to the likes of the Chesterfield Sofas.

...seems a pretty simple concept to me.

It would have made sense to get asking what people would like before now. I understand you may be busy, but it seems a lot isn't getting done currently. There aren't many rare values staff anymore, they all have reasons for resigning though, why should they be expected to do the work if some aren't pulling their weight or setting an example.

We did. We carried out a survey..... in 2013. Luke (Mr-Trainor) wrote out a plan for reform too.

So again, we're now actually doing something about it rather than more talk and more paragraphs, most of which are demanding that Habbox Rare Values continue to value thousands of rares: something that we can't do as had been explained.

We're not binning all these items for the fun of it or to purposely annoy people. We're doing it because we have to.

Sorry, it seems like an unfair rant, but you've been in the position a long time now and it's frankly not getting better. It's early days for the reform understandably. However, I just hope that when this is finally sorted correctly that you still have users for it.

This isn't anything against you Dan, it's more I don't think people agree how the reform has been done, me included.

Reform has been talked about now for years and nothing was done.

It is being done now.

I do have a question, we're rare values staff told about this before it went live?

Yes.

In weekly reports, in a public thread, in a thread in the staff forum and in a Private Message to all RV staff + General Management.

If you can get me a slot on the BBC News at 6 o'clock too i'd be delighted.

I do ask though for those who use our value pages that they please bare with us over the next few weeks as many items will be moving around on the pages, categories will be disappearing and everything will basically be up the wall.

I will keep you updated on when the reforms are completed and when we reach the next stage.

I posted that in the public announcement.

We're now onto the next stage as the structure for the new categories are being finalised with General Management, which is why I just posted for people to start suggesting items to bring back onto the pages: help which is more than welcome.

....you just posted this on my profile page -

I do think it'd work as long as items that do definitely need to be on are there.

Is that not what I just made clear and asked for in my post I made earlier?

Why do you think I am asking people for suggestions of items of interest to be returned to the pages? For fun?

[Lewis]

Why on earth would you even bother removing seasonal and teleports though? They should remain categories...

And I don't know if this is how you did it, but why not remove things step by step? First items located in the catalog (excluding some specific items commonly traded & change in value), then any worthless items that have known values and don't change in price, and so on!

Don't just remove every category you first see lmao!

[MKR&*42]

Why on earth would you even bother removing seasonal and teleports though? They should remain categories...

And I don't know if this is how you did it, but why not remove things step by step? First items located in the catalog (excluding some specific items commonly traded & change in value), then any worthless items that have known values and don't change in price, and so on!

He just removed whole categories which explains why a lot of teleports vanished as they were in the ''unnecessary''/removed categories such as Accessories, can't explain for seasonals though

[lawrawrrr]

Just because categories have been removed, it absolutely does not mean theyre staying that way. Some of the items mentioned in this thread, as well as some more that have been brought up privately, will be going back on the system - but categorised in a different way. This will take a little while though as we'll have to do it all manually!

[Lewis]

Just because categories have been removed, it absolutely does not mean theyre staying that way. Some of the items mentioned in this thread, as well as some more that have been brought up privately, will be going back on the system - but categorised in a different way. This will take a little while though as we'll have to do it all manually!

Is it not possible to make changes but not make them public until they are complete? Then do any suggestions then?

I'm not an expert when it comes to making sites, so I don't know if it's possible for that lol